Put your clothes on Imaufo, you givin' the by's some ideas.
0 Kudo
*** Whale wars*** Sea Sheperd vs Illegal Japanese whaling.
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 newfie2 |
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Posts: 3461 (09/28/09 19:07:51) |
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BSP |
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Posts: 2199 (09/29/09 02:18:58) |
Still won't show yer face 'eh?
From the looks of it yer panties haven't been of in a while either!;-) |
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 isdaby |
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Posts: 2830 (09/29/09 02:56:02) |
ufo,
these are your words...Knowing the Japanese, as demonstrated in WW2, what the Japanese want, the japanese get...they will stop at nothing untill they achieve their aims..unless they are stopped from getting what they want, of course, buy a determined foe. That is the lesson of history. The way i see it, the SS Steve Irwin is our version of the Enola Gay. and Paul Watson is Little Boy. my response was based on your verbal attack of Japan and Japanese motives...so, you got japanese freinds? share these thoughts with them and see what they think...I'm not calling you racist, just responding to what you posted...and what you posted is suspect....you generalise 'japanese' not specify 'nasty whaling companies' and you invoke the atomic bombing of Hiroshima ...think about it (although independant thinking does not seem to be your strong point)... your words. If you want a more clear analogy...if the whalers were Israeli and you said the SI was like the 'showers of Auschwitz'...not much different IMO. how words are used does matter. |
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isdaby |
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Posts: 2832 (09/29/09 03:04:39) |
Idababy the way you speak in your last litle ditty seems to make out that you think its ok to go out and provoke others so that you can become richer?
If you just want something you go out and take it? Is this the way you think?
what are you talking about? when did I say anything remotely like this? |
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Imaufo22 |
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Posts: 1788 (09/29/09 03:12:26) |
so, you got japanese freinds? share these thoughts with them
already have isdababy already have. Fact is the japanese whalers are in fact japanese, and as we are talking about whalers, and japanese whalers at that, i fail to see whay such specifications are necessary. it seems that youa re almost desperate to draw some sort of racist overtones in everything, perhaps you feel people are being racist against you in stopping your little seal hunting. Anyway how about you try real hard to actually come up with something interesting to say instead of always attacking the messenger. It does get a tad boring after a while replying to your emotional tirades. For instance, why dont you come up with some sort of justification or proof that whales were not saved by the activities of sea Sheperd. |
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isdaby |
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Posts: 2833 (09/29/09 03:50:13) |
For instance, why dont you come up with some sort of justification or proof that whales were not saved by the activities of sea Sheperd.
you can not prove a negative...you can not prove that the full quota was not taken because SSCS was there. Nor can you, without other data, prove that SSCS was not effective...its open to interpretation. Did the SI get between the whalers and the same number of whales that were not taken from the quota? my exact point, if you read my post, was that PW can not know how many whales he actually saved so he claims the number that was not taken from the quota...or some other cool sounding number. Its how he rolls... as for racism, read my post agains. I was responding to your post and the words that you used. not the words you switched to later. Initially you were saying 'japan, Japanese'...not nasty whaling companies. Your distinction came later. wether or not you are racist I don't know or care. and haveing japanese friends is no proof. in the US, many people who are accused of racist behaviour will say ''who me? I can't be racist, I have black friends"... It really matters how you use words as they can be interpreted in ways that you may not have intended them to be... |
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isdaby |
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Posts: 2834 (09/29/09 03:55:21) |
Fact is the japanese whalers are in fact japanese, and as we are talking about whalers, and japanese whalers at that, i fail to see whay such
specifications are necessary. then you are in a racist manner generalising all Japanese as the same as the whalers...ask your Japanese friends if they
agree..
in that line of thinking, I can say that Australians are racists...when I may really only be thinking about the ones who attack Asian students ...because they are racists, and australian racists at that...so why is there any need to distinguish? (I say this only to strengthen my points...not that I actually believe it) you need to step back from Paul Watson's speechs...as he speaks in the language of racism, and lies, and will argue to justify that he can do that... |
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Imaufo22 |
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Posts: 1789 (09/29/09 04:09:21) |
What language do you speak isdababy? You are but a rabble rowser with nothing much to say.
You always seem to be swinging hardest when the chips are not falling your way. The same tactics you speak most vehemently against ...the ones you claim are used by ARA's..are the ones you seem to cherish the most? Your tactics are interesting but nothing but a distraction. you can not prove a negative...you can not prove that the full quota was not taken because SSCS was there. Nor can you, without other data, prove that SSCS was not effective...its open to interpretation. Did the SI get between the whalers and the same number of whales that were not taken from the quota? my exact point, if you read my post, was that PW can not know how many whales he actually saved so he claims the number that was not taken from the quota...or some other cool sounding number. Its how he rolls... So are you saying PW has been inefective or not? Or are you just stirring the pot? my exact point, if you read my post, was that PW can not know how many whales he actually saved so he claims the number that was not taken from the quota...or some other cool sounding number. Its how he rolls... Fact is that the Japanese have not fulfilled the quota. I think there is litel doubt this is due to sea Sheperd and Paul watson. tell me this, if sea Sheperd are nothing more than a mosquito bite to the Japanese, why are they so keen on shutting him down? Quid pro quo isdababy..
Last Edited By: Imaufo22
09/29/09 04:12:29.
Edited 1 times.
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isdaby |
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Posts: 2835 (09/29/09 05:08:00) |
words are important, and statements need to be supportable...
Fact is that the Japanese have not fulfilled the quota. I think there is litel doubt this is due to sea Sheperd and Paul watson. tell me this, if sea Sheperd are nothing more than a mosquito bite to the Japanese, why are they so keen on shutting him down? lets beat our heads against the wall...again... the fact that they didn't fill their quota may be due to SSCS, but it may not be. simply put, quotas are often not taken, for many hunts/fisheries and for any number of reasons. The simple fact that hte quota is not taken, while someone is protesting and interfering, does not automatically mean that that interference prevented the quota from being taken. but, PW will claim the victory anyway...because he doesn't need proof. just followers like you. and as for why would the japanese want to shut PW down if he wasn't the cause of them missing their quota (which I don't say he is or he isn't, just its not proven)? think about it. how would you respond to someone getting in your way on your way to work, or to the grocery store...some nutcase keeps trying to run you off the road, throws rocks and clods of dirt at you...yet you still make it to work anyway...would it matter that you managed to make it to work? or would you still be really pissed at that nutcase?? think before you type. for once. |
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newfie2 |
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Posts: 3462 (09/29/09 06:31:45) |
It's hard to say how many whales SS would have prevented from being killed by the Japs during the days of confrontation. I'm not sure that Watson can
claim saving all that remains of the quota that were not taken by the Japs. I do assume that he prevented many from being killed while in contact with the
factory ship but after he breaks off the harassment, we have to know if the Japs ran out of time to take the remainder of the quota. Did they run out of whales
or did they run out of time?
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Imaufo22 |
Whale forensics highlights threat to species | ||
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Posts: 1801 (09/30/09 15:26:16) |
A high proportion of the whale meat on sale in Japan comes from a population of north Pacific minke whales that some fear is under serious threat.
The finding, from a forensic DNA study of meat bought on Japanese markets, suggests that either Japan's scientific whaling programme is taking more animals from this population than previously estimated, or accidental "by-catch" of the whales in fishing nets is larger than officially reported. Vimoksalehi Lukoschek of the University of California, Irvine, and Scott Baker of Oregon State University in Newport, along with their colleagues, bought samples of whale meat in Japan and used DNA analysis to determine in each case not only the species of whale, but also which population it came from. They found that a disturbingly high proportion came from a population of north Pacific minke whale that was selected for protection by the International Whaling Commission (IWC) in the 1980s, before the wider moratorium on commercial whaling came into effect. http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17890-whale-forensics-highlights-threat-to-species.html |
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isdaby |
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Posts: 2847 (09/30/09 17:06:35) |
but they are taking them via the 'research' loophole. As long as this loophole exists, it can not be illegal...
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Imaufo22 |
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Posts: 1806 (09/30/09 18:03:05) |
Legalities and moral behaviour are often two different things Isdababy.
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Imaufo22 |
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Posts: 1807 (09/30/09 18:05:24) |
and as for why would the japanese want to shut PW down if he wasn't the cause of them missing their quota (which I don't say he is or he isn't,
just its not proven)? think about it. how would you respond to someone getting in your way on your way to work, or to the grocery store...some nutcase keeps
trying to run you off the road, throws rocks and clods of dirt at you...yet you still make it to work anyway...would it matter that you managed to make it to
work? or would you still be really pissed at that nutcase?? think before you type. for once.
Isdababy, having read your previous ( most recent) posts, it does not become someone of intelligence to post such silliness. + |
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isdaby |
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Posts: 2850 (10/01/09 05:24:37) |
Imaufo22 wrote:why wouldn't they want to shut him down. Clearly he is a thorn in their side, wether he prevented tehm getting their full quota or not. My point is that this does not prove he stopped them filling their quota as you seem to say it proves... he is out their endangering their ships and crew, and profit margin. Of course they want him stopped. its academic. |
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Imaufo22 |
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Posts: 1810 (10/01/09 05:51:29) |
Isdababy even the japanese admit to this...they blame PW for not getting enough whale meat back to be sold...its academic.
Also please remember this isnt supposed to be about profits...remember its " scientific whaling". Its such as blatent lie and insult to th eintelligence of people that even you seem to have forgotten to uphold the falacy. |
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isdaby |
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Posts: 2853 (10/01/09 07:52:14) |
Imaufo22 wrote:Hey, if the whalers actually say that PW is preventing them from getting enough meat, What can I say. My point was to contradict what looked like your claim, that becasue the Japanese wanted to get him out of the way, it was proof that he was preventing them from getting their meat...and my point to that was that this alone doesn't prove it, because they would want him out of the way for being a hazard and a nuicance too, even if they were getting all their meat... as for profit? what do I know about that. I'm just a blogger who doesn't give a %%!* wether the Japanese get their whales or not...but if your going to make an argument, it has to work. you hadn't presented adequate evidence. Do you have a reference where the Japanese whalers are saying they want him gone because he's preventing them from getting enough meat? or is the one of PW's inventions? |
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Imaufo22 |
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Posts: 1813 (10/01/09 17:35:17) |
Hey, if the whalers actually say that PW is preventing them from getting enough meat, What can I say.
Try nothing? The Japanese are hot for PW and want him scrubbed out. Thats because PW is effective and costing the whalers money. The very fact that they are so vigilant against sea sheperd tell syou all you need to know about PW's effectivness. Do you have a reference where the Japanese whalers are saying they want him gone because he's preventing them from getting enough meat? or is the one of PW's inventions? Is this a humble request isdababy? Or is this something that you will rub my nose in the sand for if i fail in my quest? What sort of odds do you think you would give as to my successin this mission? Even money? 10-1? Just how confident are you Isdababy that PW has invented this? Please I would dearly love to know. Are you a mere mozzie bite or a big hungry bear? |
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isdaby |
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Posts: 2856 (10/03/09 16:02:43) |
I have no idea if PW invented this or not, and since you are posting the claim, I am asking you for a reference/link. It is my experience though, as I have
stated ad nauseum, that PW doe make things up , does lie , does fabricate little peice s of 'evidence' to suit himself.
so, I humbly ask you to try to verify your claim that the Japanese have said themselves , that PW has prevented them from getting their meat. |
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Imaufo22 |
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Posts: 1818 (10/03/09 17:32:53) |
"I have no idea if PW invented this or not, and since you are posting the claim, I am asking you for a reference/link"
Ok, so you admit you have no idea about this, yet you infer that Paul Watson is making unsubstantiated claims? Surely a reasonable person would expect you, Isdababy, to substantiate your own claims rather then just shooting from the mouth, as you are want to do, and asking for proof that you are wrong? Surely when you make claims or accusations or questions someones's impropriety, you should be proving to us that you are indeed right in your accusations? I make no claims other than the japanese whalers have already admitted that Paul Watson is costing them whales. The Japanese whaling fleet is not doing very well on either front. In the field this season, they were shut down for three weeks as Sea Shepherd pursued them for over 2,000 nautical miles and they have lost one of their three harpoon vessels to ice damage. I think everyone realises by now that the Antartic weather is fickle and ships can only spend so much time down there before they are forced to return to port with the onset of winter like conditions. Therefore if they whaling ships are running from Sea Sheperd for three weeks, logic would dictate that time lost = money lost. You are from Canada Isdababy. I am sure that you understand the nature of fickle weather? so, I humbly ask you to try to verify your claim that the Japanese have said themselves , that PW has prevented them from getting their meat. Here is your verification Isdababy. This one is from 2008, or two seasons ago. Japanese whalers blame 'sabotage' by activists as fewer whales are killed Tuesday, 15 April 2008 A Japanese fishing fleet is expected to return from its latest expedition having killed just over half its target number of whales. The 8,000-tonne Nisshin Maru factory ship and five other whaling vessels were due to dock in Japan last night after returning from the Antarctic laden with the meat from 551 minke whales caught during a four-month "research" voyage which was repeatedly targeted by animal rights activists. The catch was far below the target of 935 set by the Japanese authorities, which in turn blamed the campaigners, the American-based Sea Shepherd Conservation Society and Greenpeace, for reducing the amount of time it could devote to hunting for "scientific purposes". Japan insists its self-declared annual quota of 1,000 whales is part of a research programme permitted by the International Whaling Commission. Opponents claim the yearly hunt is commercial whaling in disguise and should be banned. Activists on board a vessel from the Sea Shepherd group repeatedly clashed with the Japanese fleet as it plied the Southern Ocean looking for minke whales and the much larger fin whales. A spokesman for Japan's Fisheries Agency said: "Sabotage by activists is a major factor behind our failure to achieve our target. We did not have enough time for research because we had to avoid sabotage." A plan to hunt 50 humpbacks was abandoned after international criticism. http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/nature/japanese-whalers-blame-sabotage-by-activists-as-fewer-whales-are-killed-809067.html Japan's Fisheries Agency says the country's whaling operation now under way in the Antarctic Ocean is likely to fall far short of the targeted catch as a result of "sabotage" by a US anti-whaling group, reports say. The operation is aimed at catching some 900 whales - 850 southern minke whales and 50 fin whales - by the end of March. But Kyodo news agency has credited an official from the agency who says the total catch will be 500 to 600 this year, as the operation was suspended for about a month following action by the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society and Greenpeace in January. International criticism forced Japan to give up a plan to catch 50 humpback whales in the operation. As the operation is partly financed by revenues from the sale of meat from whales that are caught, the expected shortage will deal a financial blow to the operation as well. http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/03/15/2190265.htm Paul Watson, captain of the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society vessel "Steve Irwin", said his crew chased the Japanese fleet through ice, rough seas and fog off Antarctica. "I don't understand where they are running to, they are still going east. We've chased them over 1,000 (nautical) miles now," Watson said. "And they are still going east and we're still following and...they haven't killed any whales in nine days." Would you like something a little more recent isdababy? Well here it is. Whale watchers and marine mammal enthusiasts around the world might be pleased to learn that Japan fell substantially short of its minke whale hunt quota, thanks largely to disruptive efforts of the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society earlier this season in the Antarctic region. Three vessels from the whaling fleet returned home this week and reported a final tally of 679 minke whales and one fin whale for a five-month effort, much of which was spent in clashes with the crew of the Steve Irwin, of the Sea Shepherd fleet. Japan's goal had been to kill up to 935 minke whales and 50 fin whales. Shigeki Takaya, a fisheries agency spokesman, told the Associated Press: "This season's catch was reduced as a result of the interference by protesters." Japan's annual whale hunt draws international criticism and has been condemned by Australia, which claims targeted whales help support that country's whale-watching industry. Here in Southern California, commercial whaling ended in the early 1900s, after Pacific gray whales had been slaughtered to the brink of extinction. Japan uses a research loophole in the 1986 international moratorium on whaling, and has little outside support and few sympathizers. -- Pete Thomas http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/outposts/2009/04/whale-watchers-and-marine-mammal-enthusiasts-around-the-world-will-be-pleased-to-learn-that-japan-fell-substantially-short-o.html The Institute for Cetacean Research has released their 2008/2009 kill figures for their whale slaughter in the Southern Ocean. They slaughtered 679 Minke whales of their targeted 935 and they only took one endangered fin whale from their targeted 50 whales. Sea Shepherd this last season has saved 305 whales from an agonizing death from the deadly explosive harpoons of the Japanese whaling fleet. The Japanese Fisheries Agency is blaming the failure to reach their quota on disruptions by the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society. "This season's catch was reduced as a result of the interference by protesters," said Shigeki Takaya, a Fisheries Agency spokesman. The Japanese whalers extended their whaling season by two weeks in an attempt to recover losses. Despite this, they took only 2% of their fin whale quota and 72% of their Minke whale quota. The estimated loss of profits is in the tens of millions of dollars. With costs increased due to security measures, the Japanese whaling industry needed to secure 700 whales to break even financially. They have failed to secure their required 700 whales. Once again the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society has negated the profits of the Southern Ocean whaling fleet. "We continue to speak the one language these whale pirates understand," said Captain Paul Watson. "Profit and loss: we need to keep their losses up and their profits down. We will eventually beat these killers with aggressively applied economics." Three vessels from Japan's fleet on Monday docked in Shimonoseki, a port town about 800 kilometres south-west of Tokyo, with the mother ship due in Tuesday, according to the agency. Two other ships returned to Japan last week. Kazuo Yamamura, president of Kyodo Senpaku Kaisha, which operates the whaling fleet, on Monday told reporters he was upset by damage allegedly caused to his ships by Sea Shepherd. "I'm enraged, and my blood is boiling with anger," he said. The company has blamed Sea Shepherd for skirmishes at sea, saying it was the protesters who escalated the attacks by ramming two Japanese vessels and pelting whalers with Whale Wars bottles filled with rancid butter. "We did not ram any whaling ship," said Captain Watson. "We blocked their loading operations and when they attempted to get by us, the harpoon vessels caused the collisions. The harpoon killer vessels are faster and more maneuverable than the Steve Irwin. To suggest that we rammed them is absurd. Three different collisions happened when they attempted to pass us to offload their whales. This year, Sea Shepherd's boat chased the fleet more than 3200 kilometres through the icy waters of the Antarctic Ocean before withdrawing in February. "I am delighted that Yamamura's blood is boiling," said Captain Watson. "I am delighted that he is enraged and I am absolutely delighted that the Japanese whalers made zero profits this year and most of all I am delighted that we saved 305 lives. That is three years in a row we have negated their bloody profits. We intend to make it a fourth year when we return to the Southern Ocean in December to once again disrupt the illegal activities of the Japanese whaling fleet." Sea Shepherd's Operation Musashi has been a success. "We did the very best we could with the resources available to us," said Captain Watson. "If we can raise the funds for a second faster vessel we will be able to do even better next season." The entire campaign was documented by Animal Planet for their hit show Whale Wars. The second season, which documented Operation Musashi, is set to air in the United States on June 5th at 9 PM on Animal Planet. "Every whale saved is a victory and 305 whales saved is a major victory, plus costing the whalers their profits for the season is an incredible victory," said Sea Shepherd 1st Officer Peter Hammarstedt of Sweden. http://whalewarstv.com/sea-shepherd-news/japanese-whalers-enraged-with-sea-shepherd.html So what do you think Isdababy, have you finally seen the light??? Do you believe the Japanese whalers when they say that Paul Watson has cost them whales? Do you think they are teliing the truth? More importantly, do you think Paul Watson is telling the truth? |
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